Zebra Huddle™

Non-Skating Officials => Working with Referees => Topic started by: Traffic Jam on July 02, 2012, 10:46:55 pm

Title: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Traffic Jam on July 02, 2012, 10:46:55 pm
As a Jam Timer you notice a blocker is Out-of-Play behind the pivot line before blowing the second whistle and referee does not call Out-of-play, What should you do?


Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Eject You Later on July 02, 2012, 11:18:56 pm
If the blocker is out of play (20 feet behind the pack) then you've waited way too long to release the jammers.  They should be released as soon as that blocker is more than 10 feet from the nearest pack skater, as at this point they are no longer part of the pack.

Blow the whistle.  Jam Timers are responsible for knowing the rules of derby and releasing the jammers at the correct time.  If a JT is not trained or experienced enough, one of the IPRs may give guidance with "Pack is up" or some other verbal cue to let the JT know that the pack has crossed the pivot line.

But generally speaking, this is a responsibility of the JT to assess.  I would also be certain to speak with your HR before the bout starts to find out what their opinion is.  I do know of some that want to make the call to release the jammers for pivot line crossings (a rarity now days...).
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Major Wood on July 02, 2012, 11:50:05 pm
Actually, I find the opposite.
It used to be common practice that jam timers make these judgments. There was a pretty significant movement away from that. Now most of the time, I find that jam timers are to wait for a signal from referees.

Also, from Standard Practices:

[rule]"No Pack" Starts
 
How should the Jam Timer handle a “no pack” at
the moment the jam start (single) whistle is blown?
The Jam Timer shall wait for a referee to signal “no pack”, then signal the jammer
start (double) whistle. [/rule]
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Traffic Jam on July 03, 2012, 12:14:35 am
Actually, I find the opposite.
It used to be common practice that jam timers make these judgments. There was a pretty significant movement away from that. Now most of the time, I find that jam timers are to wait for a signal from referees.

Also, from Standard Practices:

[rule]"No Pack" Starts
 
How should the Jam Timer handle a “no pack” at
the moment the jam start (single) whistle is blown?
The Jam Timer shall wait for a referee to signal “no pack”, then signal the jammer
start (double) whistle. [/rule]

The pack exists 20 feet ahead of the pivot line {second 10 foot line} creating an out of play for all skaters behind the pivot line. I don't think a No Pack applies.
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Noah Tall on July 03, 2012, 12:30:45 am
I want the Jam Timer to wait for a no pack call, but when there's a straggling blocker, s/he definitely should be calling once the pack has passed the 10' line.
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Eject You Later on July 03, 2012, 01:51:21 am
Actually, I find the opposite.
It used to be common practice that jam timers make these judgments. There was a pretty significant movement away from that. Now most of the time, I find that jam timers are to wait for a signal from referees.

Interesting, and good to know.  No packs I do instruct the JT to wait for the call before the double tweet.  But when I have an experienced JT I haven't had issues with them judging the 10 foot.
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: J. Ref K. on July 03, 2012, 01:57:32 am
Actually, I find the opposite.
It used to be common practice that jam timers make these judgments. There was a pretty significant movement away from that. Now most of the time, I find that jam timers are to wait for a signal from referees.

Also, from Standard Practices:

[rule]"No Pack" Starts
 
How should the Jam Timer handle a “no pack” at
the moment the jam start (single) whistle is blown?
The Jam Timer shall wait for a referee to signal “no pack”, then signal the jammer
start (double) whistle. [/rule]

The pack exists 20 feet ahead of the pivot line {second 10 foot line} creating an out of play for all skaters behind the pivot line. I don't think a No Pack applies.

Right, and in that situation the Jam Timer should typically hear a "pack is front" or "pack is here" and release the Jammers at that time.
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Insane Troll Logic on July 03, 2012, 02:42:32 am
If it's a situation where the pack has crossed the pivot line, but one blocker is trailing the pack by more than 10 feet, then the jammers must be released. This is the Jam Timer's job. During those types of situations, I'm looking intently at the jam line watching for the slightest bit of track to show between the rearmost pack skater's rearmost wheel and the pivot line itself. My peripheral vision is wide enough to tell whether a trailing blocker is within 10 feet and is therefore part of the pack. If so, wait, rinse and repeat.

If it's a No Pack situation, wait for the refs to call it. It tends to happen quickly, and often, but don't anticipate it. Wait for it to be called. However don't let that distract you from identifying when the last pack skater has crossed the pivot line. Knowledge of the rules is key.
Title: Re: Jam Timer and Out-of-Play
Post by: Traffic Jam on July 04, 2012, 07:51:41 am
Thanks everyone now i have a better understanding what should be happening.