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Non-Skating Officials => General NSO Discussion => Topic started by: ShoNuff on November 07, 2012, 08:47:28 pm

Title: NSO Cert is active
Post by: ShoNuff on November 07, 2012, 08:47:28 pm
NSO cert has announced that they are now up and running.

The deadline for applications for the November evaluation cycle is November 15th.

As no one has taken the tests yet, only skater reps can proctor them.  As certified NSOs who have taken the tests come into being they will also be able to administer the tests.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on November 20, 2012, 08:27:07 pm
So... has anyone passed the test yet? Looking at the NSO Certification Checklists I don't see anyone who has.  I have to say, it was hella-hard.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Cliquework on November 20, 2012, 08:42:39 pm
Refrain from discussing the test and what's in it here, please.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: FNZebra on November 20, 2012, 08:57:06 pm
I think he means discussing the test in vague, hand-wavy terms, how your prepped for it, the impact on your soul, and so on is fine.

Don't go into nitty-gritty details about anything that isn't already listed publicly on the WFTDA site. Failing to heed that speaks directly to your professionalism and a few other things that are considered important by NSO Certification. That exam is covered by the NDA.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: bjmacke on November 20, 2012, 10:51:55 pm
(Not part of Cert, speaking as someone who dealt with similar stuff in a day-job capacity)

The cert test contents should not be discussed with anyone because it invalidates the purpose of the test. Everyone needs to go into the test knowing only the things that they studied and not the actual content. This makes the content more secretive than many of the general things we hear about through the WFTDA NDA, and more along the lines of Ump's password to the WFTDA Boards.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on November 21, 2012, 12:28:16 am
It was not my intention to discuss details of the test. I was just wondering if anyone had passed it. I don't think it breaks the NDA to say that it was difficult.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Cliquework on November 21, 2012, 03:58:23 am
All is well, and thanks for the edit. No specifics were leaked or anything, but I also feel we shouldn't let loose that there is a "difficult section on cat memes" or whatnot. Even that is knowledge of the test.

Only fresh meat should be offered to the grinder.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Samuel Bergus on November 22, 2012, 05:18:22 am
I also feel we shouldn't let loose that there is a "difficult section on cat memes" or whatnot. Even that is knowledge of the test.

I imagine that a sample test will be posted on the WFTDA website as some point, much like the rules test, at that point everyone will be able to see how hard that cat memes section is.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Numb3r Crunch3r on November 22, 2012, 06:46:44 am
I also feel we shouldn't let loose that there is a "difficult section on cat memes" or whatnot. Even that is knowledge of the test.

I imagine that a sample test will be posted on the WFTDA website as some point, much like the rules test, at that point everyone will be able to see how hard that cat memes section is.

There is no sample referee certification rules test on the WFTDA website. There is a rules test in the appendices to the WFTDA ruleset, but I believe the intention of this ruleset is to allow a skater, or an official new to the rules, to confirm their first understanding of the rules and make sure they're on the right track (some leagues also use passing this test as a skater-bouting requirement).

Comparing that test to the WFTDA referee rules test is a bit apples and oranges, I think.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: The Gorram Reaver on November 22, 2012, 11:47:04 pm
I imagine that a sample test will be posted on the WFTDA website as some point, much like the rules test, at that point everyone will be able to see how hard that cat memes section is.

There is no sample referee certification rules test on the WFTDA website. There is a rules test in the appendices to the WFTDA ruleset, but I believe the intention of this ruleset is to allow a skater, or an official new to the rules, to confirm their first understanding of the rules and make sure they're on the right track (some leagues also use passing this test as a skater-bouting requirement).

Comparing that test to the WFTDA referee rules test is a bit apples and oranges, I think.

Apples and water buffalo is more like, I'd say.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Numb3r Crunch3r on November 23, 2012, 05:57:34 am
I imagine that a sample test will be posted on the WFTDA website as some point, much like the rules test, at that point everyone will be able to see how hard that cat memes section is.

There is no sample referee certification rules test on the WFTDA website. There is a rules test in the appendices to the WFTDA ruleset, but I believe the intention of this ruleset is to allow a skater, or an official new to the rules, to confirm their first understanding of the rules and make sure they're on the right track (some leagues also use passing this test as a skater-bouting requirement).

Comparing that test to the WFTDA referee rules test is a bit apples and oranges, I think.

Apples and water buffalo is more like, I'd say.

Well, I was tempted to go for a more extreme analogy, but then I thought '...well they're both *tests*, and apples and oranges are both *fruit*...'

How about apples and, like, pomegranate? One being easy to eat and the other being a blasted nuisance :P
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: bjmacke on November 23, 2012, 05:22:21 pm
Maybe it's a durian fruit. It's spiky, difficult to harvest and open, and even if you do succeed in getting at the fruit, only a small percentage of people actually enjoy the experience.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: The Gorram Reaver on November 23, 2012, 10:00:14 pm
Maybe it's a durian fruit. It's spiky, difficult to harvest and open, and even if you do succeed in getting at the fruit, only a small percentage of people actually enjoy the experience.

An apt analogy indeed, sir.  [tips hat]
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Shovel on December 01, 2012, 06:39:45 am
I must say that I think it was a good test, and those who pass deserve certification (I didn't). And it takes the full time allotted.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Bladeybug on December 04, 2012, 05:03:42 pm
So... has anyone passed the test yet? Looking at the NSO Certification Checklists I don't see anyone who has.  I have to say, it was hella-hard.

As of today on NSO Cert it still looks like 2 people have reported passing.

I was told very few finished it in the time allotted. I certainly didn't pass my first try as I had ABSOLUTELY no idea what to expect. I did manage to finish it, and came pretty close to passing. I hope to pass my second try!

I am told by a source I trust that people on the WFTDA forums have access to sample questions (without answers), if that is true, it sure would be nice if that were available to anyone taking the test, and not just those who are taking the test who also have access to the forums  :/

As for the discussion of a possible sample test/ref sample test etc, there *is* a "WFTDA Written Rules Test- Sample written test for the WFTDA Standardized Flat Track Roller Derby Rules. Includes answer key" on the WFTDA officiating page that one could argue is a sample ref test.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: ShoNuff on December 04, 2012, 05:25:20 pm
The sample test on the website is in no way meant to be a sample of the ref test for ref cert.

There are no sample questions provided to anyone for the NSO test.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: FNZebra on December 04, 2012, 11:59:15 pm
I am told by a source I trust that people on the WFTDA forums have access to sample questions (without answers), if that is true, it sure would be nice if that were available to anyone taking the test, and not just those who are taking the test who also have access to the forums  :/

As for the discussion of a possible sample test/ref sample test etc, there *is* a "WFTDA Written Rules Test- Sample written test for the WFTDA Standardized Flat Track Roller Derby Rules. Includes answer key" on the WFTDA officiating page that one could argue is a sample ref test.

Time to start trusting that source less, then. They are blowing smoke where you sit.

There are no sample questions available on the WFTDA forums, for either officiating certification exam. With or without an answer key.

As both Sho and I have passed the Referee Certification written exam, I will echo that the test on the officiating page is not intended to represent the contents of the certification exam. Nor does it.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on December 05, 2012, 04:20:56 am
I guess this is the test that people are talking about:

http://wftda.com/rules/wftda-rules-test.pdf

And you are saying that it isn't a "practice test" in any real sense of the word. I totally agree with that. On the other hand, if you couldn't pass this test, you'd have real trouble with the official test.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: bjmacke on December 05, 2012, 05:15:45 am
Yep, the public WFTDA Rules Test feels like what you'd take to get a driver's license. The Cert Test feels like something you'd take to be an EMT... if that helps clarify the difference.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Bladeybug on December 05, 2012, 10:30:02 pm

Time to start trusting that source less, then. They are blowing smoke where you sit.


Good to know. And disappointing for my relationship with said person.

Thanks.

Also Congrats to Parking Lot of Toronto Roller Derby for being the first to receive certification via the new test!
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on December 10, 2012, 06:00:18 am
Ref cert is a piece of cake compared to NSO cert.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Eject You Later on December 10, 2012, 02:03:04 pm
Ref cert is a piece of cake compared to NSO cert.

Eleventy billion officials that have not been granted certification may take issue with that.

Not to mention that I know of at least one official that passed the NSO cert test the first time, whereas the ref cert test... not so much.

It all depends on your focus, and your test taking preferences, etc.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: Numb3r Crunch3r on December 11, 2012, 12:35:57 am
Ref cert is a piece of cake compared to NSO cert.

Eleventy billion officials that have not been granted certification may take issue with that.

Not to mention that I know of at least one official that passed the NSO cert test the first time, whereas the ref cert test... not so much.

It all depends on your focus, and your test taking preferences, etc.

Agreed - I passed ref-cert on the first try a couple of years ago, and missed NSO-cert by 1 mark recently due to a stupid mistake. I'd rate them of similar levels of difficulty, but requiring significantly different types of knowledge. Relative difficulty depends on your personal levels of that knowledge.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on December 13, 2012, 09:37:42 pm
I understand the argument that they are of similar difficulty. I guess I shouldn't have compared the two.  My issue with the NSO cert test is the extreme amount of detailed responses required, which increases the likelihood of a mistake through simple oversight rather than lack of knowledge. Ref cert is difficult in a different way.

(And yes, like Numb3r Crunch3r, I passed ref cert on my first try while failing NSO cert due to a stupid mistake, so I am biased).
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: The Gorram Reaver on December 13, 2012, 11:11:00 pm
(And yes, like Numb3r Crunch3r, I passed ref cert on my first try while failing NSO cert due to a stupid mistake, so I am biased).

See, I too am in that category and don't consider the NSO test more difficult than the Ref test.  The NSO test felt so much easier.  The NSO test didn't leave me mentally & emotionally demoralized with a brain that just barely remained functional through the duration of the test, and the Ref tests always do.
Title: Re: NSO Cert is active
Post by: DocSkinner on December 14, 2012, 03:05:27 am
I see that. I guess the difference is the definition of "easier."

I'd rather puzzle through a few difficult problems than worry about getting right every one of a thousand simple things.