Zebra Huddle™

WFTDA => Rules Discussion => Topic started by: General Hellativity on November 05, 2017, 07:36:30 pm

Title: Star Pass Destroys the Pack
Post by: General Hellativity on November 05, 2017, 07:36:30 pm
This is not something that I saw happen this weekend, but the question may have been *inspired* by something that happened.

Gold Jammer is held up by a Purple blocker wall about 15 feet ahead of the pack. Gold Pivot skates forward from the front of the pack into an essentially bridging position, at which point, she receives an otherwise legal star pass from Gold Jammer. (see diagram)

The star pass, if legal, creates a split pack.

Question: Legal Pass, or Illegal Pass?

In favor of "Illegal Pass,"
[rule]4.2.1... if a Skater’s illegal action destroys the Pack, or if a Skater’s actions prevent or delay the reformation of a Pack, that Skater should be penalized...[/rule]
This is the new rule under which Pack Destructions are now called. It doesn't specify skating away from a pack or anything, only any illegal action that occurs that destroys the pack. Passing the Star to destroy the pack *seems* to be of the same level as "illegal" as skating to destroy it. After all, Gold Jammer is taking an action that clearly will cause her and everyone else to adopt an unblockable position. ALSO, destroying the pack at this precise moment is a huge game advantage to Gold team, since their Pivot-Turned-Jammer will certainly get through immediately.

In favor of "Legal Pass,"  Passing the Star is derby, and possibly should be treated like blocking: if it happens to destroy the pack as part of normal gameplay, no penalty should be assessed; it is not an *illegal* action that destroys the pack. But *skating* isn't, on its own, an illegal action either. ALSO: If the action is illegal, then no jammer status is transferred by the action and the pack *isn't* destroyed, so it cannot be illegal. IT'S GODEL'S INCOMPLETENESS JAMMER

Maybe I just answered my own question.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Star Pass Destroys the Pack
Post by: llama of death on November 08, 2017, 04:42:03 pm
In favor of "Illegal Pass,"
[rule]4.2.1... if a Skater’s illegal action destroys the Pack, or if a Skater’s actions prevent or delay the reformation of a Pack, that Skater should be penalized...[/rule]
Precisely, if an ILLEGAL action causes a no pack. The starpass was legal therefore no penalty should be issued for the legal destruction of the pack.

In favor of "Legal Pass,"  Passing the Star is derby, and possibly should be treated like blocking: if it happens to destroy the pack as part of normal gameplay, no penalty should be assessed; it is not an *illegal* action that destroys the pack. But *skating* isn't, on its own, an illegal action either.
Yep, you got it.
Title: Re: Star Pass Destroys the Pack
Post by: Bluebeard on November 08, 2017, 10:35:28 pm
What Llama said. 

Also, it would be really tough to get that just right so that the star pass would destroy the pack.  The pivot would have to set up their bridge at 9.5 feet then the jammer would have to come back only to 11 feet and pass the star.  Otherwise, either the pivot destroyed the pack before the star pass, or the jammer turned blocker takes over the bridge from the pivot turned jammer.
Title: Re: Star Pass Destroys the Pack
Post by: General Hellativity on November 10, 2017, 05:31:10 pm
What Llama said. 

Also, it would be really tough to get that just right so that the star pass would destroy the pack.

Actually, it did just about happen in P2J7 of Texas vs Minnesota this week. I initially thought that's what the penalty might have been called for. But then I realized it was an OOP Star Pass just before the No Pack was actually called.
Title: Re: Star Pass Destroys the Pack
Post by: Vanilla VICE on November 13, 2017, 10:04:40 pm
Wow this is such a good play to think about. I'm on board with the other answers, but thank you for sharing that one.