Menu

ZH Classifieds
ZH Files
ZH Staff
WFTDA 12/1/2014 Rules
WFTDA 3/1/2014 Rules

Donate

Please Support Zebra Huddle!

Recent Posts

London Roller Derby Referee Sessions by 3Beers
July 14, 2020, 01:34:46 pm

Re: Jammer's time in penalty box by 3Beers
April 26, 2020, 09:46:33 pm

Getting officials attention by Rego_Derby
March 03, 2020, 04:05:02 am

Re: Jammer's time in penalty box by Major Wood
February 05, 2020, 05:52:31 pm

Jammer's time in penalty box by 3Beers
January 29, 2020, 03:33:20 am

Nashville Roller Derby 2020 Scrimmage-A-Thon - 7/11/2020 by Major Wood
January 27, 2020, 09:36:38 pm

Re: Rule clarification by 3Beers
January 26, 2020, 08:09:00 pm

Re: Rule clarification by Bluebeard
January 17, 2020, 05:26:46 am

Rule clarification by 3Beers
December 28, 2019, 06:04:00 pm

Re: Resources for new referees. by Destructor
November 29, 2019, 01:13:40 pm

Author Topic: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7  (Read 5219 times)

Offline C-Spine

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Stats Sheet: 0
Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« on: October 08, 2010, 05:10:15 am »
Ok fellow Zebras--  I need clarification on 8.6.7--

[8.6.7][/At the end of the jam the Jammer will score on Blockers ahead of the engagement zone who were not scored upon during that scoring pass.]   

So here is my question.  Say for some reason a blocker ends up ahead of the pack and outside of the engagement zone as the Jammer is coming through the pack.  According to 8.3.1.2, once the jammer has cleared the foremost skater in the legally defined pack by 20' her scoring pass is complete and she begins her next scoring pass immediately (even though she has not yet caught up to the OOP skater)  Now once she passes that OOP skater 8.3.1.2.1 says that points for blockers that are out front of the engagement zone are counted as part of the previous (just completed) scoring run. 

Here is where the debate begins...  Once the Jammer is past the OOP blocker (even by a few feet) and the OOP blocker has not yet rejoined the pack and the jam ends, according to 8.6.7 she gets a free point for that blocker.  My interpretation is that the jammer gets that point for the OOP blocker because even though she just passed her, that point for the legal pass is counted towards the previous scoring pass, even though she is into a new scoring pass which according to 8.3.1.2 is as soon as she clears 20' in front of the pack.

What is your take on this?


Offline Theshoveler

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 120
  • Stats Sheet: 7
  • Even at work I point to the lead jammer
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2010, 05:42:47 am »
That would be ignoring this:
[rule]
8.3.1.2.1.1Blockers that advance or chase forward out of the Engagement Zone (as described in Section 8.3.1.2.1) must return to the Engagement Zone immediately (see Sections 6.10.6, 6.10.11, and 6.10.17), and only after they have returned to play are they eligible to be scored on in the normal manner and counted in the totals of the current scoring pass.
[/rule]

Until the Blockers return to the EZ they cannot be scored upon in the current pass.  If they are passed by the Jammer and then return to the EZ and subsequently skate ahead of it again and the Jame ends, then yes they should be scored upon per 8.6.7. 

The Shoveler
Worst Ref Ever

Offline C-Spine

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Stats Sheet: 0
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2010, 02:08:49 pm »
Right, but then where does rule 8.3.1.2.1 -( Blockers that advance or chase forward out of the Engagement Zone are considered part of and belonging to point totals of the previous (just completed) scoring pass.)  come into play?

It just doesn't add up for me... By what you are saying, if a blocker skates out front of the engagement zone and is out of play then she can't be scored on?  That seems counter intuitive to working to keep the pack together...

What is the ideology behing 8.6.7 then?


Offline Cliquework

  • Superhero Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 1306
  • Stats Sheet: 55
  • EGO sum Speculum. Noxiae poena par esto.
  • League Affiliation: Demolition City Roller Derby
  • Referee Certification Level: Level 3
  • NSO Certification Level: Not Certified
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2010, 02:15:12 pm »
She can be scored upon. If the jammer passes her while she's out of play, she counts towards the previous pass.

Should the jam end right then, she would not be counted as a point for the next pass.

Don't forget the blocker also cannot linger out there for long anyway, or she'll soon become a Not On The Track point (by way of being sent to the box).
« Last Edit: October 08, 2010, 02:19:41 pm by Cliquework »
Demolition City Roller Derby Head Ref
Evansville, IN
Zebra Huddle Moderator
WFTDA Refcert Checklist

Offline C-Spine

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Stats Sheet: 0
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2010, 02:24:57 pm »
Where is the rule that says she must return to the EZ before this rule would apply?  No one I have talked to can reference one... Everything I can find supports that blocker being counted as a point even if the Jammer just passed her... (I am just playing devil's advocate here as this is the heart of an ongoing debate.)

Offline Cliquework

  • Superhero Member
  • **********
  • Posts: 1306
  • Stats Sheet: 55
  • EGO sum Speculum. Noxiae poena par esto.
  • League Affiliation: Demolition City Roller Derby
  • Referee Certification Level: Level 3
  • NSO Certification Level: Not Certified
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2010, 02:35:19 pm »
[rule]8.6.3 - If the jam ends when the Jammer is still in the pack, the points for any passed opponents will be announced
 immediately.
          8.6.3.1The Jammer will also be awarded points for Blockers on the track and ahead of the Engagement Zone if said
           Blockers were not previously scored on during that scoring pass.[/rule]

This references the fact that a Jammer must come around again and make it to the pack to score on opponents who are OOP. If a Jammer had just passed an OOP blocker and the Jam ends, she would not get an additional point for that OOP blocker. That coupled with the rule Shoveler quoted shows that an blocker would not be scored upon again until she returns to play. As I mentioned earlier, that blocker also must return to play or face OOP penalties. That will also encourage bringing her back to play.
Demolition City Roller Derby Head Ref
Evansville, IN
Zebra Huddle Moderator
WFTDA Refcert Checklist

Offline C-Spine

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
  • Stats Sheet: 0
Re: Rule Clarification on 8.6.7
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2010, 02:41:45 pm »
OK, I can agree with all of that... Thanks for the clarification

 

Featured Product

 

Zebra Huddle Head Referee Bout Booklet

 

Featured Classifieds


ZH Files

How to Score a Point in Roller Derby
Rating: *****
Downloads: 4609
Views: 7919
Filesize: 327.61KB
Date: January 17, 2017, 04:21:03 am
Comments (0)
By: AdamSmasher
June 2013 Ruleset situational questions
Rating: *****
Downloads: 3092
Views: 6452
Filesize: 29.71KB
Date: February 07, 2014, 04:57:32 pm
Comments (2)
By: Crash Test Ref
Rules Q&A and Publications for 6/15/13 Document
Rating: (None)
Downloads: 3311
Views: 7433
Filesize: 26.27KB
Date: August 02, 2013, 04:10:40 pm
Comments (0)
By: Shaun Ketterman
Rules Q&A and Publications for 1/1/13 Document (4/24/13 Updates)
Rating: *****
Downloads: 4142
Views: 9443
Filesize: 28.07KB
Date: April 25, 2013, 05:45:34 pm
Comments (0)
By: Shaun Ketterman

Powered by EzPortal