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Author Topic: Cutting + OOP  (Read 3468 times)

Offline Simon Says

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Cutting + OOP
« on: October 21, 2012, 11:11:22 pm »
Jammer behind 2 blockers @ 19ft. Jammer blocked out by rear blocker. Blockers then reach 21ft. "OOP" called. Blockers instantly at 19ft again. Jammer comes in in front of both.
Penalty?

Thanks
+Simon

Offline Numb3r Crunch3r

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Re: Cutting + OOP
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2012, 11:36:29 pm »
Penalty will depend on the specific position of the blockers to each other at the moment of re-entry by the jammer.

The initiating blocker is subject to 6.11.1 (Re-entering behind the initiator of a block) - specifically here:

[rule]6.11.1.4 When the initiating skater exits the Engagement Zone at any time after the initiating block.[/rule]

Thus, as she has gone out of play, re-entering in front of her - even after she is back in play - will be a no-pass no-penalty situation.

The other, uninvolved blocker, regains her 'in play' position the second she re-enters the engagement zone, and cutting penalties being to apply again as soon as that happens.

If she is behind the initiating blocker by the hips, then it is a minor penalty - the initiating blocker is the 'foremost opposing blocker', and the jammer has only cut the other blocker - minor penalty. (6.11.8 and 6.11.9)

If she is in front of the initiating blocker by the hips, then it's a major - she is the foremost opposing blocker, which is a cutting major, even though the jammer has only cut one person. (6.11.15 and 6.11.17)
« Last Edit: October 21, 2012, 11:38:29 pm by Numb3r Crunch3r »

Offline Simon Says

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Re: Cutting + OOP
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2012, 07:51:06 am »
That is a perfect answer. Thankyou so much!
So going out of play is only relevant for the initiator of a block. If while a skater A goes out of bounds from behind an opponent Z, if that opponent goes out of the engagement zone then back in, Skater A can be penalized if they come back in in front of opponent Z. Is that about it?
Cheers

Is it the same for going down?

Offline Numb3r Crunch3r

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Re: Cutting + OOP
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2012, 09:42:27 am »
That is a perfect answer. Thankyou so much!
So going out of play is only relevant for the initiator of a block. If while a skater A goes out of bounds from behind an opponent Z, if that opponent goes out of the engagement zone then back in, Skater A can be penalized if they come back in in front of opponent Z. Is that about it?
Cheers

Is it the same for going down?

Exactly. Same applies for going down - going down at any time is only relevant for the initiating skater - if an unrelated skater goes down, then stands up again, she's eligible to be cut.

Offline Simon Says

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Re: Cutting + OOP
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2012, 08:58:38 am »
When does the cut occur?

I was discussing this with some refs with far more experience than I and one of them stated that it is relevant to when the hips pass. If in the moment the hips pass the in bounds skater is out of play, Then there is no penalty even if the inbounds play is back in play when the previously out of bounds skater comes back onto the track. I was under the impression its decided when the skater who has been out of bounds comes back in.

Your comments?

Offline Numb3r Crunch3r

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Re: Cutting + OOP
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2012, 10:16:24 am »
A cut isn't a cut until the skater is entirely in bounds and upright/skating. Straddling skaters have not yet cut.

All positioning is measured at the instant the skater is entirely in bounds and upright/skating. If, while out of bounds, she skates past a person, then as she steps back in bounds, she thrusts her hips backwards so that at the instant of re-entry the hips are behind that skater's hips - that's not a cut (I've actually seen that one happen several times - many skaters know to get their hips as far back as possible to avoid cuts).

Similarly, other than for 'initiating' skaters (for whom 6.11.1 applies), the position of a skater is only relevant at the moment of the cut - this is why a downed skater can get up, and still be cut, or an OOP skater can re-enter the engagement zone and still be cut.

 

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