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Author Topic: Using Forearms to remain in bounds  (Read 2943 times)

Offline bmd (2113)

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Using Forearms to remain in bounds
« on: March 02, 2015, 03:40:10 pm »
I wasn't able to find this scenario in a previous post - your insight on this call is appreciated.

Yellow Pivot is in front of the Red Jammer. They are both skating derby direction near the track boundary but still in bounds. Yellow Pivot initiates a block on the Red Jammer. Red Jammer is about to go OOB as a result of the block. Red Jammer, using her forearms and/or hands, grabs the Yellow Pivot's hips to remains in bounds.

Assume for this example that the Red Jammer's grab does not impede the Yellow Pivot's mobility (5.5.8 ) nor does it significantly alter the Yellow Pivot's established position, trajectory or speed (5.5.10) - it was just enough to keep the Red Jammer in bounds. Also, for this example, there was no (other?) change in relative position (5.5.7) or other skaters involved (5.5.9).

[rule]Penalty

5.5.6 - Any illegal forearm or hand contact to an opponent that forces the receiving opponent off balance, forward, and/or sideways and causes the opponent to lose relative position.

5.5.7 - Any illegal forearm or hand contact allowing the initiator or a teammate to gain relative position, or causing an opponent to lose relative position.

5.5.8 - Use of hands or forearms to grab, hold onto or hold back an opponent impeding that opponent’s mobility.

5.5.9 - Contact to an opponent, using the hands or forearms, in order to assist oneself in blocking a different opponent.

5.5.10 - Any pushing with the hands or forearms that significantly alters an opponent's established position, trajectory or speed.[/rule]

Does the Jammer's use of forearms against the Yellow Pivot to remain in-bounds warrant a Forearms penalty?

Thanks in advance.
Alex Cline
bmd (2113)
Cincinnati Rollergirls

Offline The Sharmanator

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Re: Using Forearms to remain in bounds
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2015, 04:04:55 pm »
I think you may have missed one.  I think this would cover it.

[rule]5.5.1 Forearms or hands may never be used to grab, hold, or push an opponent.[/rule]

So, I think that makes it pretty clear the action is illegal, there it is in writing, you can't do it.  So now the next question in your thought process should be does the action rise to the level of it being penalized?  I think this particular action is one of those on the spot judgement calls.  I would have to actually be there to see what happened.   I know under the 5.5 Penalty section it doesn't address this particular action.  But, you have to remember WFTDA can't address every perceivable action that can happen on the track.  I would say this is a good "make the call ref".  I believe a penalty could be called in the right situation.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2015, 12:49:18 am by The Sharmanator »

Offline BadgerBadger

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Re: Using Forearms to remain in bounds
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2015, 11:22:42 am »
I think it's clear that in the current rules this is explicitly illegal, but not explicitly a penalty, and not explicitly NI/NP. I'm also not sure there is a consensus on the question currently. Therefore it's really a judgement call currently.

I've called this type of action as a penalty in the past, both when it prevented the skater goon OoB and when it prevented them going down. I've also not called it for both of those situations, in situations where it simply didn't seem right. I don't know if that makes me inconsistent in a bad way - I'd like to think that I've only called this when I felt it necessary.

Offline Mav'Ricky

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Re: Using Forearms to remain in bounds
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2015, 12:58:13 pm »
I don't know if that makes me inconsistent in a bad way - I'd like to think that I've only called this when I felt it necessary.

I think that shows excellent use of judgement, especially in lieu of a clear guideline on use of illegal actions to prevent loss of relative position.
Be fair. Be clear.

 

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