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Author Topic: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)  (Read 40419 times)

Offline Professor Murder

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2009, 07:07:59 pm »
There's also some degree of "pretesting" in place that either (1) suggests someone with a negative score isn't someone with any good ideas at all (or that someone with a high score never has any bad ideas), or (2) that we should further scrutinize those posts for something to discover that's negative about it.

I think it's generally a good idea, in theory.  I'm lacking a full opinion on its execution as of yet, however.

Tweaking it to permit 1 +/- per post, if that's not already the norm, should be a sufficient addition.  What we don't know from the poster's score is if they have made repeated dunderheaded posts, or if they simply made one and were 'majored' hard by multiple users for that.  Same for those with higher scores: did they simply show one brief glint of useful insight, or are they just awesome on the whole?

So 1 +/- per post might help alleviate the transgressions of those users who benefit, or suffer from, the perceptions of a single post.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I'm not wholly against the policy or siding with anyone.  It's a system that can be abused easily, to be sure.  With that in mind, a substantial negative score is not something to attribute solely to the site structure.  If you have a negative score, there's undoubtedly some degree of personal responsibility for that as well, and something to keep in mind.  It may not be a beautiful policy, or one that's perfect.  But it does have merit.  Fer shure.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2009, 07:10:38 pm by Professor Murder »
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Offline Jessticular Fortitude

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2009, 07:54:03 pm »
One of the good things about the stats sheets (in my opinion, anyway) is that they are anonymous. While I do like the idea of having a maximum number of +/- you can get from a single post, I don't think we should feel obligated to have to email you when we change your stats. From the way these threads are going, if someone agrees or disagrees with your post, they've pretty much always been posting right after what they think about it. It should be fairly obvious that what you said was out of line because of the response directly after. If you read those responses and then notice that your stats have changed, unless you're posting tons a day you can probably guess what it was you said that rubbed people the wrong way.

Obviously if you post a lot or don't log in everyday that plan is flawed, but hell, we can't make everything perfect for everybody.
Hey look, a search function! Right up there! No on the left

Perhaps we should all spend a little more time reading and a little less time making shit up.

Offline L8R SK8R

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #17 on: January 29, 2009, 08:06:58 pm »
I didn't necessarily mean that you should post every time you give someone a Major, but here I am with a whole lot of negative, and so far I've only really had two people post back at me in strong disagreement. So I mention posting when you're giving a Major only for the sake of helping the recipient figure out why they are getting the negatives. Personally I see two reasons to give a Major: being dead wrong on a rule and claiming it as fact or being a douchebag. It would be nice to know, if you receive a Major, which they thought you were doing so that you can stop doing that in the future. I've received a bunch of Majors, but I haven't felt I've been a douchebag. If I have, or if someone thinks I'm consistently way off on rules discussions, it would be nice to know. I mean, no matter how much I enjoy reffing, the reason I joined this forum, and watch the Yahoo group, and read other derby stuff, is to better my kowledge of the rules, so that I can better serve my league. I mean, I could just show up and do a half assed job, but that's just not cool. So if I'm posting way off on the rules, enough that it merits a Major, it'd be nice if someone gave me a heads up either by a post in the thread or even just a quick personal message saying something like "hey man, you need to read the rules a few more times again cause you seem to be missing important clauses." If for no other reason that mutual, communal respect.

Offline Jessticular Fortitude

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #18 on: January 29, 2009, 08:13:07 pm »
Fair enough.
Hey look, a search function! Right up there! No on the left

Perhaps we should all spend a little more time reading and a little less time making shit up.

Offline Foul Bundy

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #19 on: January 29, 2009, 09:46:14 pm »
Since you have to explain yourself when you change someones karma, maybe share that info (but not the name of the changer) with the person receiving the change.  Especially if it's a negative change.  That way the affected will be able to know which post got them in trouble and be able to defend themselves. 
The code of conduct set forth seems reasonable to me. I also agree with the choice of moderators.  I don't know any of them personally, but have read posts by all of them and think they will do a fine job. 
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Offline Riff Reff

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #20 on: January 29, 2009, 10:33:24 pm »
actually I think the stat sheet is a gimmick this forum does not really need... you find out by the number of posts and reading some of them how reliable a user is... I am sitting here in Germany and I have never met any of you guys but I can tell within 5 minutes who the top-notch forum users are  it's worth listening to...

You may say that the number of posts says nothing about the quality of the posts.. that's right.. but that is what moderators (good choices btw) are for... there's the report button... if someone's a REAL douchbag the moderators will find out and take the actions necessary...

I do not get why L8rsk8r has so many Majors... If I look at the posts I find nothing abusive or argumentative..
I do not get why I got 4 GS... I am such a rookie... I am a reciever of knowledge here...

I would get rid of that stuff and focus on what we are really here for... Derby Love to y'all!
« Last Edit: January 29, 2009, 10:36:24 pm by Riff Reff »
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Offline bronco

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #21 on: January 29, 2009, 11:11:49 pm »
well, I think the stats turned into a poll after I made a suggestion, and I received seven majors in a row.

there is also a tendency NOT to applaud folks with negative stats (I am still -4) irrespective of their content

so, I invite you all to read my posts and get my stats back in-line

... Bronco
working my way slowly up
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Offline Professor Murder

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2009, 11:50:03 pm »
Now, see, there's something I'm fond of the stats for, but also hate them for.  I was waiting to see how long it would take before folks began to clamor/ask for "grand slams."  Which defeats the purpose.

Ask for people to read your posts, respond in kind if necessary.  Ask for people to nicely point out why you are deserving of a major should you get one.  If a poster is so compelled to shit on your posts, the least they could do is offer an explanation of why.  Otherwise, it just seems like an arbitrarily-based popularity contest.

But don't ask to "get your stats back in-line."  Help put them back in line yourself.  By soliciting karma, you're going to draw more negative attention to yourself, I'm afraid.  And I say this as a well-versed adventurer in the internets, like many others here.
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Offline Major Wood

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2009, 12:14:45 am »
Now, see, there's something I'm fond of the stats for, but also hate them for.  I was waiting to see how long it would take before folks began to clamor/ask for "grand slams."  Which defeats the purpose.

Ask for people to read your posts, respond in kind if necessary.  Ask for people to nicely point out why you are deserving of a major should you get one.  If a poster is so compelled to shit on your posts, the least they could do is offer an explanation of why.  Otherwise, it just seems like an arbitrarily-based popularity contest.

But don't ask to "get your stats back in-line."  Help put them back in line yourself.  By soliciting karma, you're going to draw more negative attention to yourself, I'm afraid.  And I say this as a well-versed adventurer in the internets, like many others here.

Well put.
While I hesitate to make it a site policy to not lobby for grand slams, it definitely defeats the system.

I understand the thoughts that it may be a gimmick. On many sites, it is a big joke. Here, I am hoping to make it a useful tool. It is still early and I am trying to work out the kinks. If it proves to simply get out of hand, I will consider removing it altogether. Give it some time.

I also understand the argument of +/- 1 per post to avoid a huge change from one post. Though I also think that sometimes a post is so useful, or so damaging that it deserves to have the input of many for the stats sheet. I will look into if the software can allow for only +/- 1 per post as an option.

And Riff Reff, just because you have limited experience doesn't mean that you haven't said things that maybe caused other refs to think of something differently. Sometimes people who haven't been involved forever have a unique perspective that allows them to see other solutions to problems.
To a certain extent, everyone needs to relax about their stats sheet and focus on providing useful input.
Your friendly Zebra Huddle admin.

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I speak only of my opinions and interpretations.

Offline Jessticular Fortitude

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2009, 12:21:50 am »
To a certain extent, everyone needs to relax about their stats sheet and focus on providing useful input.

Yes. Quality > quantity.
Hey look, a search function! Right up there! No on the left

Perhaps we should all spend a little more time reading and a little less time making shit up.

Offline L8R SK8R

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2009, 01:50:37 am »
I also understand the argument of +/- 1 per post to avoid a huge change from one post. Though I also think that sometimes a post is so useful, or so damaging that it deserves to have the input of many for the stats sheet. I will look into if the software can allow for only +/- 1 per post as an option.

The argument is a good one, but then you have the possibilty of someone abusing that system by Major-ing a good post before someone can Grand Slam it, and that's a whole new can of worms.

The system is good as it stands. Its just that situations like mine, where I was suddenly at -12 without any posts explaining why people might have an issue with my posts, brings up the idea that, while the Karma points are a good idea, it is just a matter of respect to let people know why you're giving them Majors, and for that matter maybe even why you're giving them Grand Slams too. I think Wood seriously fixed this issue with requiring explanations for Karma actions. We're a small community of volunteer refs who give a lot of our time to a sport we all love. We need to remember that and remember we are all here to learn from each other, and to support each other, and the sport of roller derby.

Offline Major Wood

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2009, 04:00:59 am »
With that said, lets return this conversation to the policy and any changes that may need to be made. The idea of the stats sheet will be revisited after adequate time has passed to evaluate how it is being used.
Your friendly Zebra Huddle admin.

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Offline L8R SK8R

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2009, 12:23:36 pm »
Other than the previously discussed issues with the stats sheet system, I think the policies are great. Very clear and concise. Good choice of mods and appropriate use committee. If someone takes issue with this policy, they probably aren't the type of person we all would want around here anyway.

Offline Three Majors

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2009, 07:52:19 pm »
I'm happy with the policies as they stand, I can certainly live with them.
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Offline Derbyoldman

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Re: Zebra Huddle policies (PLEASE READ AND COMMENT)
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2009, 02:49:35 pm »
these are just good common sense rules/practices. . works for me

 

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